Just installed the ICAT

[mtk]

Originally Posted by Coopsvintageyz

Yea, but the length of the high tension is still a little further for the spark to travel?

It's the speed of light. That's 187,000 miles per second, or 987,360,000 feet per second. The time delay is immaterial.

Next, the whole notion that some add-on doodad can "increase spark energy" without an actual energy input into the system, is a physical impossibility. There are no free lunches in life, here or anywhere else. Without some outside source of power, that claim is false on its face. All it can do is remove energy from the system and redistribute the timing of it.

It's the same with those "Power Now" carb nozzles. They can only remove energy from the intake air stream. They improve the signal to the carb on the bottom end of the powerband (the gain) and hurt power on the top end (the loss) but hope the bike has enough top end power so you don't notice.

The laws of physics don't take a day off, ever. If it sounds too good to be true, more than likely it is. The question to ask yourself is, if some $50 bit could really do everything they claim, why didn't the manufacturer do it in the first place? These companies have lots of intelligent people working for them and are always looking to boost power output and go to great lengths to do it. If a propeller in the intake stream (or some other bogus "performance enhancer") could do it, they'd have it there from the factory.

[Crazy]

The Icat just makes the spark duration longer by using a voltage doubler configuration it looks like to me. I looked up the patent on it and right in the patent it says uses a diode and capacitor type configuration to create a longer spark. Diode and cap = voltage doubler.

I believe this product would work as described by burning gas more effiently etc, but I cant see a big gain.

Oh btw MTK if the length doesnt matter then why do we use VSWR?

[FFRacing11x]

I love these threads! They give me a "boost" till the Sunday Funnies come around.: Tdub

[ossagp1]

where is that guy with the KX60rs125 roadracer,,he may need one!!!

[mtk]

What is VSWR?

Since my EE is a bit rusty, how does a diode and capacitor double voltage?

[crazyrydermx]

Originally Posted by mtk

There are no free lunches in life

Sure there are. Just go to your friend's house and grub there

[Coopsvintageyz]

Originally Posted by Crazy

The Icat just makes the spark duration longer by using a voltage doubler configuration it looks like to me. I looked up the patent on it and right in the patent it says uses a diode and capacitor type configuration to create a longer spark. Diode and cap = voltage doubler.

I believe this product would work as described by burning gas more effiently etc, but I cant see a big gain.

Oh btw MTK if the length doesnt matter then why do we use VSWR?

I believe you are right about the conductor, it will only work one way as it has a plus and a minus, I believe it has a diode in it for one way travel, but I haven't checked it with a ohms meter yet, My next move was to check the timing while running it, I just haven't spent that much time with it after it didn't work for me? It felt like it was retarded.( Kinda lazy feeling) I should have just advanced the timing while I was riding with it last, but I just wanted to ride!

[Coopsvintageyz]

Originally Posted by mtk

What is VSWR?
Since my EE is a bit rusty, how does a diode and capacitor double voltage?

I believe when you kick the bike over at first, it store voltage up,( possibly doubling it?) and then when a certain amount of voltage is stored, it then releases the higher voltage, with a longer duration. this is my take on it?

[kuritaro9]

there was a thread on DRN about how to make your own for $15...pretty much all it is is a phillips BY8424 diode" i think thats the PN#"...never had a chance to try to make one myself, but i have an icat on my bike,and i dont have any complaints. but honestly, i have done so much modifying to the bike, that i cant tell anymore where and how it helped or hurt.but, i think it helped the most right off idle... honestly, i have forgotten all about the thing...

[kuritaro9]

here is the link to the us patent. it might help if someone wants to try and make one to try...

[Only registered and activated users can see links. ]

[mtk]

Originally Posted by Coopsvintageyz

I believe when you kick the bike over at first, it store voltage up,( possibly doubling it?) and then when a certain amount of voltage is stored, it then releases the higher voltage, with a longer duration. this is my take on it?

Capacitors store current, not voltage. Voltage is the shorthand word for electromotive force, which is basically the "pressure" pushing the electrons through the system.

A capacitor is like a battery. It will store current but it can't increase voltage.

A diode is just a one-way valve for a circuit; it will flow in one direction and not in the other.

A brief reading of the patent left me less than impressed. In addition, they're not plowing any new ground here; capacitors are a known quantity and there isn't any mystery in the function of an ignition system.

More than ever, I'm convinced this thing is a load of bunk. If it worked and was that easy, it would be standard equipment.

[Coopsvintageyz]

So maybe it is just storing more current for a longer spark duration , that would explain why it would be better for extra fuel burning.

[mtk]

The function of the ignition system is to light the fire. Once the fire is lit, you have no need for the spark as the flame front propogates outward from there.

So far, it hasn't "explained" anything.

[FFRacing11x]

Originally Posted by mtk

The function of the ignition system is to light the fire. Once the fire is lit, you have no need for the spark as the flame front propogates outward from there..

Finally!!

[crazyrydermx]

Originally Posted by Coopsvintageyz

extra fuel burning.

So does this mean, from what mtk said, that it would just be burning the fuel at improper times? It would then just be burning more fuel, because it would be burning it after the explosion has happened (which it does as soon as the spark plug lights)? More spark does NOT matter, it all has to do with the fuel and air...so I just can't see how this would show any results. I could understand how it could effect timing, but nothing else.

[Coopsvintageyz]

I think it is supposed to fire at the same time, but just hold the spark longer? so then it would possibly burn more fuel if the air is there for it to burn more fuel, which I guess there could be? sense the two stroke engine isn't the most efficient burning thing. maybe ICAT has found that there is extra air and fuel to be burnt? It would depend on the motor.
Good discussion though!

[Coopsvintageyz]

Originally Posted by mtk

The function of the ignition system is to light the fire. Once the fire is lit, you have no need for the spark as the flame front propogates outward from there.
So far, it hasn't "explained" anything.

So then why do we have so much Hydrocarbons( raw and unburnt fuel) coming out of or exhaust? way more that a four stroke?
I think this is were the ICAT fits the bill.

[boogieonmyfinger]

Isn't the unburnt fuel due to the fact that some of the gas passes through the cylinder without actuallygetting burnt during the compression phase? Doesn't it get scavenged right along with the exhaust?

[FFRacing11x]

Originally Posted by boogieonmyfinge

Isn't the unburnt fuel due to the fact that some of the gas passes through the cylinder without actuallygetting burnt during the compression phase? Doesn't it get scavenged right along with the exhaust?

EXACTLY

[crazyrydermx]

Originally Posted by boogieonmyfinge

Isn't the unburnt fuel due to the fact that some of the gas passes through the cylinder without actuallygetting burnt during the compression phase? Doesn't it get scavenged right along with the exhaust?

Yes! Since there is a VERY small amount of time where the piston isn't past the exhaust, the fuel that has just been brought in (reeds) must get out somewhere. A tiny amount of fuel just creeps out of there.
The spark would have nothing to do with that, unless it was in the exhaust:
Also, holding the spark longer doesn't do anything. All the engine needs is fire. It's spark timing that effects performance...not how long the spark holds.