All Things Moto! Dirtbike Forums

Go Back   All Things Moto! Dirtbike Forums > Dirt Bike Knowledge Base and Build Threads > Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds

Reply
 
LinkBack Thread Tools
  #41  
Old 05-19-2015, 08:48 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

     

I sold the old Cylinder to some guy in canada via ebay,..but didn't notice anything. I didn't readily notice any build up in the head either. But I will continue to pick things apart as I get into it.

Dogger I have a whole Microsoft word doc of your suggestions and I've added this series of suggestions to it. Will do the motor procedure to ensure proper assembly. You know what has crazy acidity? "PH down" it is a chemical used for fish tanks to lower Ph quickly,...though a drop will burn a hole in your clothing,. make marks as it hits wood floors etc.... Ill use vin or some of that to get things rolling.

I just did a google search of the city I got the bike from and found this....
Seems like a lot in the water. in NYC the PPM is 54.

Q: What is the hardness of the water that is supplied to our house?

A: The typical water hardness in Lake Havasu City's water supply is 325 parts per million (ppm). This question is usually asked when someone has a new water softener and in reality, the total dissolved solid concentration is important. The total dissolved solid concentration ranges between 700 and 800 ppm. Water softeners in the city are usually set at 19-20 grains.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 06-14-2015, 09:34 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

I didnt notice a wrist pin bearing in my wiseco piston kit...do I need the wiseco brand replacement or should I buy the OEM version...????
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 06-15-2015, 06:04 AM
char393's Avatar
cha cha
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Last Online: 05-23-2017 03:00 PM
Location: Conroe, Texas
Posts: 19,940
Default

Probably not the most technical person to throw advice out there, but I've used both wiseco and oem wrist pin bearings with wiseco pistons.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 07-06-2015, 10:50 AM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

I got the Wiseco bearing... Tore the engine apart further.. No further signs of Corrosion in the water flow area.... [IMG][/IMG]

---------- Post added at 09:45 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:44 AM ----------

Rod that goes through the clutch basket and so on seems worn at one end...

[IMG][/IMG]

---------- Post added at 09:46 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:45 AM ----------

How do you guys know when to replace the clutch basket due to wear....mine seems minimal. Does anyone hit it with a scotch brite or use any other technique to "freshen" it up?

[IMG][/IMG]

---------- Post added at 09:47 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:46 AM ----------

[IMG][/IMG]

---------- Post added at 09:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 09:47 AM ----------

I hit the cases with a rubber mallot and it split but I need the puller to get it apart nicely...I'll probably just have my local shop do it. Then I can get to the end of things and start rebuilding back up from the start.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 07-06-2015, 11:24 AM
cowboyona426's Avatar
JOATMON
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Last Online: 07-24-2017 09:42 AM
Location: Newport, WA, USA
Posts: 9,374
Default

Clutch basket and hub look OK, it's normal to have some marking there but you don't want deep grooves that will keep the clutch from disengaging. Push rod is definitely worn beyond limits!
Reply With Quote
  #46  
Old 07-06-2015, 01:10 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

Yea its more a light scuff than a deep notch on the basket. Yea the push rod,...the previous owner must have been a heavy clutcher.
Reply With Quote
  #47  
Old 07-07-2015, 12:03 PM
dogger315's Avatar
ATM! Pro Class
 
Join Date: May 2009
Last Online: 07-20-2017 09:29 AM
Location: CA
Posts: 2,512
Default

Quote:
Yea its more a light scuff than a deep notch on the basket. Yea the push rod,...the previous owner must have been a heavy clutcher.
No, he was a "keep the clutch lever pulled in instead of shifting to neutral" and wore out the engagement shaft. If he was a heavy clutch user, the basket would be notched up, especially with the cheap OE cast basket.

I don't use OE baskets because I do use the clutch every time I come out of a corner, even on a 500. A stock basket would last me about one weekend worth of motos. The CR500 is a tough call because there are no billet pieces available except for the basket unless you do the CR250 clutch conversion. Depending on what kind of riding you do, that conversion may or may not be worth the cost and time. As far as checking for wear, load a new clutch plate in the assembled basket. There should be very minimal clearance on either side. If there is a gap, somebody has already "touched up" the basket to remove notching and the basket will snatch on engagement and wear out even faster.

One word of advice, if you stick with the OE clutch, don't pack it with aftermarket Kevlar plates. They will eat up the soft castings in no time, stick with OE Honda plates.
Reply With Quote
  #48  
Old 07-07-2015, 06:06 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

I have a new EBC clutch plate kit with springs and plates etc sitting in my parts box back at the build. You could prob bet good money that its kevlar... Ill have to pick up a Hinson basket,..maybe throw my basket on Ebay or what not. Or if one of you guys want it cheap...let me know..its in pretty good shape. My riding isn't anything crazy..its cross country and woods riding. But I want a solid machine.... in this case the project is more about building a pretty bad *** bike than any specific purpose. About the journey, not the destination , if you will. Of course you all know the destination of my wallet as I travel the journey..

Last edited by Sponge500; 07-07-2015 at 06:16 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #49  
Old 07-08-2015, 04:33 PM
dogger315's Avatar
ATM! Pro Class
 
Join Date: May 2009
Last Online: 07-20-2017 09:29 AM
Location: CA
Posts: 2,512
Default

Good call on the Hinson basket. It's a hard anodized billet piece that will
take a lot more abuse than the OE casting.

One change I do recommend for the 500 is replacing the Aluminum plates
with Steel. The heavier plates will give you a little flywheel effect (a very
good thing for trail riding), and they won't shill and contaminate the tranny
oil like the Aluminum plates.

Quote:
Of course you all know the destination of my wallet as I travel the journey.
Only too well, unfortunately.
Reply With Quote
  #50  
Old 07-08-2015, 07:34 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

Its an EBC dirtrider clutch with steel plates...

re: my breakdown of the motor so far..I just keep unbolting and tearin things down..I put each assembly or specific purposed item into paper bags and line the bags up in a box,...I assume this will help with reassembly...I still have the feeling its going to be a bit like solving a puzzle. Ill figure out a system though,... I feel like getting organized is going to really help with reassembly.
Reply With Quote
  #51  
Old 07-31-2015, 06:28 PM
Beginner Class
 
Join Date: Sep 2013
Last Online: 07-07-2017 01:47 PM
Location: Central Florida
Posts: 28
Default

Great build Sponge.... I felt the same way when I did my first engine. But do what your doing, stay organized, constantly check the manual and if in doubt, post a pic and ask these fine folks here. But when your done and it fires for the first time, it will all be worth it!.....
Reply With Quote
  #52  
Old 08-01-2015, 03:56 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

Thanks Lrgfather,..ill continue with the build in a week and a half..will post more pics then.
Reply With Quote
  #53  
Old 09-25-2015, 12:42 AM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

currently halted on the build. I mentioned this in another thread but im not sure if this ghroup read it. I had the cases split and crank spec'ed. The local dealer said the crank was at its "service spec limits" and suggested i order a new one. I mentioned this to the people at crank works and they came close to $320 or more to get it back in shape...nearly the cost of a new one. So send it to crankworks or buy a brand new one? Im leaning toward new.. then basically only the cases will be original.
Reply With Quote
  #54  
Old 09-25-2015, 09:46 AM
JMV's Avatar
JMV JMV is offline
Expert Class
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Last Online: 06-21-2017 11:07 PM
Location: Central Coast, Ca
Posts: 979
Default

Are you quoting crank works $320 for balancing? If so, that is not equivalent to a new OEM crank. It is superior. Rebuild only from them would be $200. $95 for rebuild plus ~$100 for the rod. I got a deal on ebay for my 87 rod.
Reply With Quote
  #55  
Old 09-25-2015, 01:37 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

Crankworks answer below up to 400 plus


The labor for a rebuild and balance is $200 + any H.M. that may be added for balancing, the Hot Rods connecting rod kit is $95 and depending on if the cans on the webs are leaking you might need a tin can mod where we go in and weld the cans to the crank to make sure they are not leaking. That service is $105, so the total you would be looking at would be roughly $400 plus H.M. and shipping.

$335 for a new one off partzilla... I guess i answered my own question
Honda Motorcycle Parts 1991 CR500R A CRANKSHAFT Diagram
Reply With Quote
  #56  
Old 09-26-2015, 10:27 AM
dogger315's Avatar
ATM! Pro Class
 
Join Date: May 2009
Last Online: 07-20-2017 09:29 AM
Location: CA
Posts: 2,512
Default

What spec on your crank is at the limit? The only thing a rebuild will correct
is the play between the crank journal and the big end bearing, assuming the
journal isn't worn.

If for instance, the OD at the crank pins is at the limit, you're better off buying
a new crank and getting it balanced. BTW, if you want a good balance vs a
"cookie cutter" one size fits all job, check out Surf and Turf Racing. They cost
a little more, but your rotating asssembly will be balanced more precisely than
what you'll get from Crankworks. That "opinion" comes from actual experience
with the two companies. The difference between the two isn't that noticeable
with a 250 crank, but is very noticeable with a 500 crank. Combine that with
the lousy turn around time at Crankworks (2 + months on average), it's gotten
to the point where I don't use or recommend them anymore.
Reply With Quote
  #57  
Old 09-26-2015, 11:59 AM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

I had the local honda dealer split my cases and check the specs on the crank. I was in a hurry so I didn't push the tech for details like i should have. In retrospect he just gave me the "get him to buy a new crank from us" story. "The manufacturer recommended specs on this crank are at or over the limits, i suggest a new one". I only asked why,..and he just said "prolonged use". The motor I am using for my conversion feels to me like it was one of those "kick it and go" owners. In fact no amount of effort could loosen the drain bolt on the bottom of the case to release the oil.(it came near rounded anyway) Id guess the oil in the thing must be 20 years old. I had to take the clutch cover off and lean it to get all the oil drained. Certainly no rebuild evidence anywhere, nevermind normal maintenance.... ill grab a new crank and then think on S&T balancing. What percentage of vibration would you estimate is the reduction from stock?? 50%
Reply With Quote
  #58  
Old 09-26-2015, 12:46 PM
JMV's Avatar
JMV JMV is offline
Expert Class
 
Join Date: Jul 2012
Last Online: 06-21-2017 11:07 PM
Location: Central Coast, Ca
Posts: 979
Default

They all shake. Even the balanced ones. Mine are all steelies and even those transmit quite a bit of vibration to the rider. An AF is going to be even more so. If you are spending the money to build an AF, rebuild the motor, etc etc why not spend the extra $150 to get the best possible product?
Reply With Quote
  #59  
Old 09-26-2015, 08:02 PM
dogger315's Avatar
ATM! Pro Class
 
Join Date: May 2009
Last Online: 07-20-2017 09:29 AM
Location: CA
Posts: 2,512
Default

Like JMV said, the 500 likes to "shake". I don't know the percentage of
reduction but getting the crank balanced will lessen the vibration at the grips
enough to reduce fatigue and make the ride more enjoyable. Since we're
talking about a single cylinder without a counterbalance, you can't actually
balance the rotating assembly per se, but you can smooth it out for a range
of RPM. For a 500, I specify 4000 to 6000 RPM. That range will cover the
meat of where you will spend most of your time.

When you are ready for the work, make sure you send the actual piston
you're going to use along with the rings, piston pin, circlips and small end
bearing you will be using so the shop has everything they need to do the
most accurate job.

Crank balancing is pretty much unecessary for a 125, a nice touch on a 250
and almost mandatory for a 500.
Reply With Quote
  #60  
Old 09-26-2015, 09:31 PM
Intermediate Class
 
Join Date: Dec 2014
Last Online: 07-16-2017 09:28 PM
Location: NYC
Posts: 128
Default

I'll do it..I mean i planned on doing it at the start. Then its like " new crank..boom $350 extra. Need to get over that,....rather II need to rationalize to myself in some nonsensical way how its fine to throw more cash at it. But your right,...i've got a sweet ride coming together,...might as well make it great. Yes Dogger,...ive got your rpm range in my brain from previous conversations,... I will send them my brand new wiseco kit...crank bearings etc. To complete my build i still need, hinson clutch basket,..front and rear wheels, front brake with reservoir, disk brakes and pads, ..seat, fmf fatty with Q stealth, tires, radiator hoses,..a new air filter, handlebar, levers, twist grip, brake lever, shift lever, foot pegs,...chain....and prob several bolts. Ching ching ching ching $$$,.. Ill grab the exterior stuff after Christmas and finish the build this spring. Will use the rest of this year to finish off the motor. One day the beast will live
Reply With Quote
Reply

  All Things Moto! Dirtbike Forums > Dirt Bike Knowledge Base and Build Threads > Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds


Bookmarks

Thread Tools


Similar Threads for: 91 cr500/ 07 crf450 build to Cr 500AF
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
CR500 Engine Build Part 6 dogger315 Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds 24 09-20-2015 12:14 PM
Compilation- dogger315's Honda CR500 AF build cowboyona426 Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds 0 12-19-2014 11:27 AM
CR500 Engine Build Pictorial Part 2 dogger315 Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds 15 02-01-2013 11:24 PM
CR500 Engine build Pictorial Part 3 dogger315 Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds 7 09-18-2010 03:14 PM
CR500 Engine Build Pictorial Part 1 dogger315 Dirt Bike Restorations and Builds 18 09-10-2010 11:56 AM


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 10:44 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0 PL2
Copyright ©2002-2017, JDub Consulting, Inc. All Right Reserved.