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Old 07-05-2007, 08:46 AM
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Default Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

     

a while back when shopping for my next bike I asked guys who ride both 250F and 450F how their lap times compared. most said they were pretty close.

This morning I saw this on racer x. They often post "sign of the (lap) times". I thought it was interesting to read the whole thing but wanted to post this clip. Keep in mind this is a sandy, rutted, rough track with some steep hill climbs right out of corners and big jumps. It refers to Ryan Villipoto, RC and JS in this paragraph.

here ya go. check out racer x online for the rest.

But the most surprising aspect of RV’s Red Bud weekend is when you compare his lap times to the MX class. Although the track was long, rough, rutted, and fast, RV’s best lap of 2:31.242 was just a tad slower than RC’s 2:30.924; and it was faster than that of James Stewart, who logged a 2:31.688 as his fastest time in Moto 2. I think this race was definitely a statement on know who is going to represent the MX2 class for the United States at this year’s MXdN at Budds Creek.
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Old 07-05-2007, 09:55 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

That's a good point, Joe

I guess one factor could be that the track is generally smoothest for the Moto1 250f's. They 450f's get the track after a whole Moto.

It will be interesting to see how RV handles the 450f when he moves up.

I remember when Bubba was running better laptimes than Ricky's CRF450 on his 125!

Awesome thread, because I believe alot of people would be surprised at how much closer 250f vs 450f laptimes are.
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Old 07-05-2007, 10:48 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

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Originally Posted by Aus_Rider_22 View Post
I remember when Bubba was running better laptimes than Ricky's CRF450 on his 125!
Hmm I think that might be pushing it a little, i do remember him having faster lap times than reed, but i dont ever remember him beating rc. I will have to research this.
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Old 07-05-2007, 10:50 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

sorry didnt mean to post that twice.
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Old 07-05-2007, 12:44 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

thanks ,

if you get a chance to read the whole article it's pretty good- and short but RV was only one second slower in the 2nd moto at 2:31. Bubba and Rc best in moto 1 was just 2:29's so he's really close for that type of track.

alos interesting and bubba-esque was that RV finished 1:30 ahead of Grant in 3rd in moto 2. wow.
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Old 07-05-2007, 01:26 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

The 250F's have brought the game up considerably. The "Lites" class used to be a stepping stone entrance into the Pro ranks, now these guys are going as fast as most of the big class guys. I still think things were way more interesting when the guys rode two strokes. Right now the privateers in the "Lites" class are less competitive than they would be if they were still on 125's. The top guys are on bikes that are darn near as powerful as 250 two strokes. When these privateers don't have the resources to spec out one of these motors their chances are dashed. But the funny thing is that the 450's are so powerful that most of the premier class guys have pretty good battles, save for the guys like James and RC who know how to handle 60+ hp machines.
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Old 07-05-2007, 03:59 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

THIS is nothing new. For ever it seems the 125's were turning times in the league with the larger bikes. They still wouldnt run even if on the track at the same time.

It was noted that the track is not usually in as good a shape for the larger class. That has a whole lot to do with times. No one that has followed racing for very long is surprised by the comparison.
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Old 07-05-2007, 05:28 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

This is a good point and proof that 450's arent too fast. The AMA is stupid in the fact that they think 450's are too big. if they say that you have to ride 350F's how is that going to help when villopoto and townley are almost as fast as ricky and james. it makes no sense. It is obvious that the bikes arent too fast, but the tracks are too fast.
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Old 07-06-2007, 08:00 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

I have followed pro racing and raced as an amature for some time now and I have even raced the vet race at red bud. I was there and watched first hand last weekend, it was awesome. Just seeing some of the 250f's jumping Larocco's leap was impressive and they did struggle more than 450's who actually scrubbed and tried to stay low when tripling.

I know 250f's are lighter and all and I have ridden and raced them as well as my 450. I weigh more than RV and RC but still think the lap times are impressive, especially on a track like Red Buuuuddd!

Mainly because sand robs power and although these are not stock bikes by any means and the 250F's have a somewhat better groomed track I am still impressed by the lap times because Red bud has huge jumps, lots of sand and elevation changes right out of corners making carrying a lot of momentum harder. By the way, these guys rode lots of practice laps before the motos ever began so the track was far from smooth even for the lites.

So to each his own and take it for what it's worth to you but Racer X and I felt it was worth passing along.

Joe

joe

Last edited by joe346CBMX; 07-06-2007 at 08:06 AM.
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Old 07-06-2007, 09:24 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

We are talking fastest lap times. Those lites guys are capable of some amazing things for a lap or two. I would be curious to see how the average lap times compare for the entire moto between the lites and mx classes and which class fell off the most.
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Old 07-06-2007, 12:21 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

Well if I remember correctly, they did one of those things a while back when James Stewart was on 125 2 strokes, and I remember that at the Washougal round, James Stewart's lap time was almost a whole second faster than Ricky Carmichael's lap times. Carmichael was on a 450, and remember James was on a 125 2-stroke.
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Old 07-06-2007, 01:23 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

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Originally Posted by yzernie View Post
We are talking fastest lap times. Those lites guys are capable of some amazing things for a lap or two. I would be curious to see how the average lap times compare for the entire moto between the lites and mx classes and which class fell off the most.
I agree with this statement. I recall seeing a couple of newcomers that laid down the fastest lap time but where did they finish? Not even in the top 20! Any decent rider can pin it for one good lap and have things fall into place but lets see the average 30 minute + 1 lap average lap time. There you will see the difference.
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Old 07-06-2007, 01:47 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

I agree with the time for the whole race approach. Imrpessive as they are, the 250f's won't run with the more experienced men on the larger bikes. But gosh oh GEE, if one of the magazines which makes it's money off of selling news (whether newsworthy or not) is impressed, then DANG, I better start realizing that I must be looking at things all wrong!!! Anyway, off to build a commemorative to the 250f's!!
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Old 07-06-2007, 02:42 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

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Originally Posted by schwen_108 View Post
Well if I remember correctly, they did one of those things a while back when James Stewart was on 125 2 strokes, and I remember that at the Washougal round, James Stewart's lap time was almost a whole second faster than Ricky Carmichael's lap times. Carmichael was on a 450, and remember James was on a 125 2-stroke.
Just to get things straight if you look at amamotocross.com and look at the fast lap times for the Washougal round, in 04 both windham and rc are almost 3 seconds faster than bubba who had the fastest lites lap time and in 03 it was just over 2 seconds. I would of looked up 02, but they dont have lap time information that far back. Just thought i would let you know.
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Old 07-06-2007, 05:58 PM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

oh yeah. that's what it was. i knew after i posted that something was wrong.
I just cant remember that far back I guess.
to manny concussions....Thanks for correcting me.
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Old 07-08-2007, 04:06 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

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Originally Posted by UnsafeHaven View Post
Just to get things straight if you look at amamotocross.com and look at the fast lap times for the Washougal round, in 04 both windham and rc are almost 3 seconds faster than bubba who had the fastest lites lap time and in 03 it was just over 2 seconds. I would of looked up 02, but they dont have lap time information that far back. Just thought i would let you know.
Thanks for correcting me

I read it on another board and assumed it was correct.
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Old 07-09-2007, 11:09 AM
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Default Re: Lap times 250f & 450f, RV, RC, JS

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Originally Posted by ossagp1 View Post
I agree with the time for the whole race approach. Imrpessive as they are, the 250f's won't run with the more experienced men on the larger bikes. But gosh oh GEE, if one of the magazines which makes it's money off of selling news (whether newsworthy or not) is impressed, then DANG, I better start realizing that I must be looking at things all wrong!!! Anyway, off to build a commemorative to the 250f's!!
Hey, I'm not sure how but it seems we got off on the wrong foot. So if I somehow offended you by posting this, I appologize. I am not cutting any bikes or riders just making note of an observation for conversation sake. Not really sure why but it seems to have bothered you based on the tone of the reply.

my experience has been It was much easier to get the job done on a 450f. I race and ride a YZ450F and love it. When I get on a 250F i feel like it's pretty darn slow so when I read this and posted it it was because I was impressed that RV was riding this particular track, even for one lap at that pace.

joe

Last edited by joe346CBMX; 07-10-2007 at 07:56 AM.
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