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  #1  
Old 04-22-2004, 08:25 PM
MotoMojo17's Avatar
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Angry EPA doesnt know crap about crap

     

look what i dug up!!

Banning 2 strokes is like trying to fall a tree by pulling it's leaves off. 2 strokes pollute more than 4 strokes, but are SIGNIFICANTLY smaller problem than cars/trucks. I've heard that motorcycles represent 1% of the pollution problem. Maybe 25% of that 1% is created by a 2 stroke.

You've heard that 2 strokes are such polluters - did you know that a 2 stroke actually emits LESS carbon monoxide than a comparable-power 4 stroke? And did you know that if you compare horsepower to horsepower, 2 strokes are only high-emmisions in unburned hydrocarbons? Most people compare by displacement, but since 2 strokes make nearly twice the horsepower per liter displacement, if you compare a 50 hp 2 stroke and a 50 hp 4 stroke, the comparison shifts a lot. The fact of the matter is that eliminating 2 stroke engines will do nothing for the environment. 2 stroke engines are just an easy target for the EPA, who have no idea how to do anything about the real sources of pollution: grandfathered, big-tax-base industrial installations. Many plants in America were built in the early 1900's and simply can't be made to be clean; so they burp out more unburned hydrocarbons in a day than all the 2 stroke engines in American emit in a year. I've lived most of my life in the Houston area, where chemical plants and refineries rule the roost - believe me when I tell you that 2 strokes are the least of the EPA's worries.

.... discuss
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  #2  
Old 04-22-2004, 08:51 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

In one ocean crossing, those feight ships put out more pollution then all 2 strokes ever made.

4strokes right now arent making emissions either.
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  #3  
Old 04-22-2004, 08:53 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

Its the special interest groups getting our toys banned. They have leverage in the EPA.

Do whatever you can to stop Sierra Club and the likes
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  #4  
Old 04-22-2004, 09:02 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

They can all go to well we all know the rest of that saying. If things continue like they are right now I may need to start considering moving to a no EPA country hhhmmmm maybe not I like ND to much.
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  #5  
Old 04-22-2004, 09:14 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

how hard are your numbers? is there a website or book or article with those percentages? i believe you, but Miss hippie Sun Shinemore, may not

i don't hate the EPA, persay, because without their flambouyant crap i'd be choking on coal smoke right now. however, they are looking WAY in the wrong direction, and picking on something that really, REALLY does not contribute to pollution. my truck, god bless its soul, in one trip to school will pollute more than twice as much as a full day of racing. the sad thing is, i'm not the only one!

after all, they can't put a Catylitic converter on the three-foot wide smoke stacks of the hydrocarbon-belching textile factory that prints "hug a tree" on a green T shirt :

Rob
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  #6  
Old 04-22-2004, 09:21 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

We all either have to stand up and protest all the BS going on, or sit back and let them take away everything we enjoy in life. I guess it starts with the first guy who stands up and wont take anymore crap from the whiners, complainers, environmentalists, EPA, C.A.R.B, law makers, and politicians.

Heck, every law and decision is made by popular choice/vote. If we don't stand up and protest for our rights and freedoms then who will? How many environmentalists are there crying versus how many off road riders are out there sitting back letting this extremist group of complainers take away our freedoms and rights? We have to speak up and represent ourselves and our sport/hobbies or else they wont think there are that many who care to preserve our sport.

The way I see it is once they get their foot in the door, they will keep pushing until eventually off roading will be a thing of the past -- since they think it so harsh on the environment. So they start with the 2 stroke and work their way up to big CC 4 strokes and before you know it we will all be mountain biking to get out in the woods to ride. Ha, bet they will ban that lastly. :

Why haven't they given 2 strokes the chaince to get cleaner like cars and diesles had the chance to do? I'm sure some expirementation on 2 stroke fuel/mix and other technical things could make them as clean as a 4 stroke.

They never think of how harsh bulldozing land to build houses and sky scrapers is, or how they send all the sewage in to the rivers do they? All larger problems they choose to ignore while they pick on the small off roading community. :

Last edited by 2kHondaCR500R; 04-22-2004 at 09:23 PM.
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  #7  
Old 04-22-2004, 09:28 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

good point honda!

i'm also wondering why they actually think pingers pollute as bad as any car. it's all BS to me.


did you know, that they have actually banned mountain biking in some places? i think the law goes something like "any wheeled vehicle meant to transport humans may not be allowed in the wilderness area" so it's discriminating on people in wheelchairs. basically, they want only fit, 30-something sandal wearin tree huggin stump humpin backpackers to go out there and poke the smot while watching a copperhead snake come right up and bite them in the arse and say "well, its just nature and i DID come on that snakes property...."

:
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  #8  
Old 04-22-2004, 09:34 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

The reason why they're picking on us, is cause they arent us, and technically, we're not being the rough and tumble people that we usually are. What I mean is, we arent taking a stance. Sure, a couple are, but EVERYONE has to. Its just like any 8th grader picking on the 5'3 6th grader, instead of the same size 7th grader. Until we show them what the real deal is, and that we arent a bunch of little people who will take it, then they are gunna keep going at us.

Max.
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  #9  
Old 04-22-2004, 09:37 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

Get up, stand up: stand up for your rights!
Get up, stand up: stand up for your rights!
Get up, stand up: stand up for your rights!
Get up, stand up: don't give up the fight!

Preacherman, don't tell me,
Heaven is under the earth.
I know you don't know
What life is really worth.
It's not all that glitters is gold;
'alf the story has never been told:
So now you see the light, eh!
Stand up for your rights. come on!

Get up, stand up: stand up for your rights!
Get up, stand up: don't give up the fight!
Get up, stand up: stand up for your rights!
Get up, stand up: don't give up the fight!

Most people think,
Great god will come from the skies,
Take away everything
And make everybody feel high.
But if you know what life is worth,
You will look for yours on earth:
And now you see the light,
You stand up for your rights. jah!

Get up, stand up! (jah, jah!)
Stand up for your rights! (oh-hoo!)
Get up, stand up! (get up, stand up!)
Don't give up the fight! (life is your right!)


Get up, stand up! (so we can't give up the fight!)
Stand up for your rights! (lord, lord!)
Get up, stand up! (keep on struggling on!)
Don't give up the fight! (yeah!)

We sick an' tired of-a your ism-skism game -
Dyin' 'n' goin' to heaven in-a jesus' name, lord.
We know when we understand:
Almighty god is a living man.
You can fool some people sometimes,
But you can't fool all the people all the time.
So now we see the light (what you gonna do?),
We gonna stand up for our rights! (yeah, yeah, yeah!)

So you better:
Get up, stand up! (in the morning! git it up!)
Stand up for your rights! (stand up for our rights!)
Get up, stand up!
Don't give up the fight! (don't give it up, don't give it up!)
Get up, stand up! (get up, stand up!)
Stand up for your rights! (get up, stand up!)
Get up, stand up! ( ... )
Don't give up the fight! (get up, stand up!)
Get up, stand up! ( ... )
Stand up for your rights!
Get up, stand up!
Don't give up the fight!
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  #10  
Old 04-23-2004, 09:58 AM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

Quote:
poke the smot
The reason 2 smokes get picked on is mostly because of the premix oil issue- you see puffs of smoke every time the engine is revved, and oil spooge all over the pipe, and they figure there must be tons more going into the environment. I've done the research and I know that 2 strokes ain't all bad (even though they are way worse than 4 stroke dirt bikes ) The BEST thing(s) you can do are: join organizations like the Blue Ribbon Coalition (BRC) and Americans for Responsible Recreational Access (ARRA). We NEED to make our opinions known! The BRC is only 20 bucks a year, and if I can afford it almost anyone can! My membership needs to be renewed, but I had to help a friend out and don't have the cash right now (I hate being a broke college bum) but I WILL renew that membership ASAP. Also, join your local trail machine club if you have one, and don't give the greenies more firepower! The last thing we need is more land closed to bikes and 4-wheelers.
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  #11  
Old 04-23-2004, 01:08 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

I'll link the site to you guys soon im in a hurry, I can't belive 2 strokes pollute less(Wonder why they hate them) probally that smoke and spooge. I don't care everyone dies sometime. I'm at least having fun while im at it.
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  #12  
Old 04-23-2004, 02:41 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

If the EPA has a problem with 2 strokes just ask them if theyd rather stand in a garage with a old k car or a two cycle motorcycle. It would be an easy test which ever one made you pass out first looses.
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  #13  
Old 04-23-2004, 09:52 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

Sorry gang…..
I have to sit back and laugh at most of these posts.

I belong to the Blue Ribbon Coalition, COHVCO, same as the BRC only in Colorado And I’m a life member in the AMA and still contribute.
The AMA does fight some of these battles. Some of the whiners should do a little homework and learn.

I began fighting these battles in the early 70’s. Went to hearings, wrote letters to my Government representatives and campaigned against all the controls and even went to protests.
Yes I spent my money doing it.

What I learned was the off road community was made up of a lot of riders, racers, families, you name it, that flat didn’t get involved.
And yes, they stood around and b------ed a lot, whined a lot, but basically did nothing.

It’s the same today.
Of all those who posted on this subject, tell me how many of you who have written your government reps on this subject. By the way it does not cost any money to do it.
Do you even know who your government reps are?
Tell me you are involved in fighting the losing of our riding areas and the loss of the 2 strokes.

A lot of this story in my area is defined in the book “Monkey Butt”.
Since then we have lost even more.

One more thing, Honda made a 2 stroke that was very close to meeting the EPA requirements but you could not afford it.
Here is a site describing it but remember this was in 1996. I pitted this bike it the Baja 1000.
http://www.motorcycle.com/mo/mchonda/exp2_tech.html
Also if someone tells you that a 2 stroke makes less polution than a 4-stroke, they simply do not know the facts.

Again I say “SORRY GANG”, basically, I bet 2/3rds of you have done nothing.
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  #14  
Old 04-24-2004, 12:15 AM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

DDFH y a new name?!

As for the pingers, they r jus looking to blame something so they can say they did something
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  #15  
Old 04-24-2004, 03:11 PM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

Mainjet, I HAVE contacted my state reps on a few occasions regarding closures to riding areas Trouble is, for every one of us that does, how many don't???
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  #16  
Old 04-25-2004, 08:48 AM
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Default Re: EPA doesnt know crap about crap

well i dont know how to do all the petitions and crap, im only 13 but i just figured you could voice your opinions on here, and i think all of you have good points....if they really do ban 2 strokes, ill make my own two stroke bike!! or i can just ride four strokes....yup i like the second one lol
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